When are feelings not valid?
A little early, I know
I had brunch with my dad this morning, following our recent issues. Going to brunch was definitely the right thing to do, but I don’t know that I’m happy I went. I certainly don’t feel any better.
We basically talked in circles for an hour. I attempted, once again, to explain why and how his behavior was hurtful for me. Even though I don’t doubt that he loves me, the way we interact still causes me a lot of pain.
And, over and over, he repeated his favorite refrains: “I can’t change what I feel. My feelings are just as valid as yours. You’re asking me to change over night. I had a son for 23 years. I’m trying.”
Hard to have pride...
So, once again, I did my best to explain where I’m coming from. How it feels when he refuses to take down pictures of me from before my transition. I said, “I realize that you perceived me as your son, and have positive associations with those memories. But I’m telling you that isn’t what happened. That person never existed. And to see you celebrate something that was so incredibly painful for me is like you’re cutting into me.”
My dad, in turn, insists that his memory is just as valid as mine. That he isn’t going to revise his memories because I’ve transitioned. That he can’t change what he feels.
And that’s the point where I just want to give up. I almost walked out of brunch today, because I don’t see how we can find any common ground if he claims his ‘vision’ of my identity is just as valid as mine. It’s not – I get to decide who I am, and who I was, not him.
Which brings me to the title of this post: When are feelings not valid? Obviously I don’t doubt that my dad is telling me the truth about what he feels. I fully believe that my transition is really hard for him. But I don’t know that I can – or should, or will – respect those feelings anymore.
The analogy I used with my dad was of racism. If I were dating someone who wasn’t white, it wouldn’t matter if my dad “honestly” felt that my partner were sub-human. I wouldn’t respect his feelings and, if he couldn’t reign them in or keep them in check, I’d tell him to fuck off and get out of my life.
“Not if I was trying, I hope!” was my dad’s reply.
Well, at some point, isn’t trying not good enough? And those “feelings” aren’t false, but I’m sure as hell not going to respect them.
My dad continues to insist that I’m asking him to change “overnight” and that he’s had “23 years of having a son.” But then he went on to say training himself to use my actual name and pronouns might take a month, a year, five years, twenty years. While I’m all for owning up to your own faults, I don’t know if I can deal with that. It’s not good for my emotional health, it’s not good for my mental health, and (as I’ve seen when I’m really stressed) it’s not good for my physical health.
In the short term, I’m thinking of telling him I need some time. I don’t really want to cut off communication with him, again, but I also really don’t want any contact with him.
As usual.
Themocracy
His feelings are legit… but your feelings of not wanting to be around him are too. I suggest as follows:
1. You’ve made clear that you would really like him to switch pronoun usage, so don’t belabor the point.
2. Not focusing on changing him, consider how much you want him around, keeping in mind that he’ll be disrespectful. Decide if it’s worth being around him on an event-by-event basis. And no, he does not get points for trying.
In your shoes in the hospital, I would have told my dad to leave, that I did not want a person who was messing with my pronouns to be around right then. However, my parents are less supportive to begin with, so it would have been an easier call to make.
Thanks, Jonah. I think you’re right about belaboring the point – we just talk in circles whenever I try to bring it up, so I’m not accomplishing anything other than frustrating myself.
And my big question know is exactly that: how much time do I want to spend with him? I’m not sure of the answer, yet.
Ya know, I have to second what Jonah said.
Sooner or later you have to decide I am getting what I need/want out of this relationship.
He’s knows how you feel.
He should know by now that the child he knew is gone and ani’t coming back.
So let him go and when he’s ready to accept you for who are now then start over with a relationship
I would have left.
He’s not proven that he can respect your rights or feelings, and that isn’t healthy. It seems like this conflict is making you start to question the validity of your own feelings, which is not healthy either. You shouldn’t have to defend your choices and your right to make those choices to someone who purports to love you.
I really appreciate your comment, Rose. I hadn’t realized this was making me doubt whether or not I’m “allowed” to be mad at him, but it was. I think situations are rarely black-and-white, which is part of the reason this is difficult for me, but ultimately I get to decide how my name and identity ‘work.’ Not him.
I definitely agree with Jonah and Rose.
Of course it’s hard for him, he is your father, who was so certain of you being his son. And when you finally told him, it must have felt like he has been wrong for so long. And that’s okay, for it to be hard. But at some point, excuse my language, tough shit.
You have had to pretend to be someone you are not for years, and even when you were able to admit it to yourself and others, it was still hard. You have so much you have to work on, at this point trying is not enough.
I’m sorry that I am new to your blog so I don’t know some details such as, have both of you been to counseling? I know it sounds silly, or too late at this point but not only does he need to work on his feelings in a more efficient way, but he also has to be shown (really shown) YOUR feelings. If you have access to that, I would suggest you give him kind of an ultimatum. If you have tried already, than I’m sorry, but I would go back to my ‘tough shit’ sentiments.
I hope you can work this out, or that you can at least be able to move forward, even if it’s without him. *hugs*
Welcome, Nanci, and thanks for your kind words.
I’ve been in therapy for a while, and really like my therapist, but I’m pretty sure my dad has not. When I’ve offered to find therapist recommendations or support groups, he’s turned me down, saying he “doesn’t need any.”
I’m definitely considering ultimatums. I sort of gave him one a few weeks ago, ending with me hanging up on him, but it wasn’t really well thought out or planned. I’d want to be more coherent if I did something similar again.
I saw you mention taking a break, and I totally support that. I understand that ultimatums are difficult put into motion because they definitely are the last resort, in most cases, when you are not willing to compromise.
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Disclaimer: I don’t know you, and I obviously have no idea about how your childhood was, so I might be very well talking crap. I mean no disrespect.
While I of course understand that the situation with your father is very hurtful and frustrating for you, I find the sentence “That person never existed” really harsh and…”orwellian”.
Were there no moments of joy and love between your father and you during all those years, even though you were stuck in a male body? Can you really resent your father wanting to hold on to these memories? Having to completely scrap these must be really hurtful for him.
Maybe I’m reading too much into it, but that sentence, or rather my perceived idea behind that sentence, having to purge my mind from all memories of a loved one, would really be nightmare fuel for me.
I think that’s a totally legitimate question, and I guess I expressed myself poorly. A more accurate way of putting it is that the person my dad remembers – his son – was always a role that I was putting on. So while there are positive memories from my pre-transition life (even for me, I do have positive memories) they’re all filtered through the perspective of my overall unhappiness at the time.
So I don’t resent my dad for wanting to hold on to those memories. And I think I could do a better job saying that I don’t think this period of taking pictures down will last forever – I’m still going through my own transition, and do hope to arrive at a place where I’m more comfortable dwelling on my pre-transition life. But, for the time being, seeing those pictures is hurtful. And I do resent him for saying A) that his version of events is as “true” as mine, which flies in the face of allowing my own self-identification, B) not behaving in the way I ask him to, and C) not seeming to do much about it beyond insisting that he’s “trying.”
Does that make more sense?
Yes, thanks for clarifying.
I hope everything works out for you in the end.
Late to the party, but I just want to add my support to you.
Everyone’s feelings here are valid—your feeling hurt at your father’s actions, what sounds like some serious grief that your father may be going through. However, though everyone’s feelings are valid, it is also more than acceptable to set boundaries based on your evaluation of your own health based on your father’s behavior.
It seems to me that your father has shown himself unworthy of your trust and that he must work to gain that back—you don’t owe it to him simply by being his offspring. Perhaps setting conditional boundaries might help, e.g. “Dad, I will come to Event X. However, if you use the wrong name or pronouns more than N times, I will leave. I am doing this not because I hate you, but because I have a responsibility to myself and my health, and setting this limit is something I feel I must do to maintain my health.” And then stick to it.
Also, glad that your physical health seems to be on the mend.
Thanks. Right now, I’m leaning toward either taking a break from him for a while or insisting that we go into some sort of family therapy or counseling. I’m not imaging I’d cut off communication – which I do think was a mistake – but make it clear I’m not interested in seeing him for a while.
You and I don’t like each other very much, so I suspect you’ll view this comment with suspicion, at the very least. I can assure you, it is offered sans malice, and with honesty and a sincere hope you’ll find it helpful.
Your father’s feelings are valid. Your feelings are valid. Your father’s walls can hold his memories without prejudice; you can dislike the pictures for the memories they bring you. Those images are not invalidating who you are, nor are they denying you any self-expression. Are you sure you’re not trying to deny him his memories?
People put up pictures of loved ones as tangible reminders of them, and of shared, cherished, moments. They want those little reminders of good times, happy smiles and joyous moments. When someone dies, it’s all we have left – their images, and our memories. Perhaps your father is trying hold onto something that is special to him? Perhaps he’s grieving for the child he knew? People invest a lot of hope in their children; perhaps he needs time to adjust to a new hope?
The pictures on the wall most likely aren’t about you. They’re most likely about himself. The way you remember those moments is not the way he does; that doesn’t mean either of you holds the one true memory. Memory is not binary; it’s not valid, or invalid. It’s not true, or untrue. It is, it simply is. It’s individual, not collective. Moments can be shared, but the memories are individual, even as they have commonalities. He remembers how he felt at those times; you remember those moments differently. He’s not denying you anything; he’s reminding himself of a past you want to discard.
You are going through a massive change in your life. Is it unreasonable for him to hang on to what are probably quite precious memories? You say that child never existed; that child was a part of your life, and his.
The person in those pictures did exist. That child was born, went to school, and matured. You wouldn’t exist if that child hadn’t existed. You might not like that child, but that child existed. And is a part of you. If that were not the case, you wouldn’t care about the pictures. But you do.
Turn your thoughts on their head: if he demanded you change, you alter your memories to comply with his, how would you feel? Quite often, when we seek changes in others, the one who has to change is ourself.
Be compassionate; they’re not just your memories.
(As for any pronoun thing – someone mentioned it in the comments – that you can insist on a change for that.)
Carolyn Ann
I appreciate your thoughts, even if we haven’t always seen eye-to-eye.
I think you’re right that having those pictures up isn’t intended to invalidate the choices I’m making now. However, due entirely to my own insecurities and work transitioning, the effect is that it feels invalidating. You’re right, the result of that is I’m asking him to change how he views his memories. But, for me, those memories are of a time having been in prison. And his celebration of that time makes me skeptical of how happy he is that I’m finally free. (In fact, I know he’s not happy, and I don’t need him to be. But, for my sake, I don’t want him to share his pain to the extent that he has.)
As for memories, I think I expressed myself better in an above comment to DrMcCoy:
Putting it another way, I absolutely agree that memories are a subjective thing. My dad’s saying “This was a happy time” and I’m saying “No, it wasn’t.” Both of those things are true to our own experiences. But I can’t go back and come out earlier or transition earlier, as much as I wish I could. So ‘pre-transition Becca’ will never be able to speak up in those pictures, to say something is wrong. Having pictures up only allows one side of the story to be presented, something that is true to his experiences but not to mine. The most I can do now is ask that they not be placed in positions of celebration, out of respect for my own pain.
You said…
Yes and no. That child existed, but the face I was presenting to the world was a false one. How I was perceived by those around me did not line up with who I was (or am). And yes – I care about those pictures not because the child in them didn’t exist, but because the mask I was forced to wear was painful and constricting. And it’s painful now to see my dad want to celebrate that mask.
If my dad said he’d been undergoing chemotherapy throughout my childhood, and wanted me to take down pictures from that time and not bring it up because it was so painful and uncomfortable for him to remember, I absolutely would respect that. If he’d been in prison, and didn’t want to be reminded of that sad time, I absolutely would respect that. He’s not affording me the same level of respect.
Which isn’t to say you’re wrong about me being the one who has to change. I definitely want to reach a point where I can look at pre-transition pictures without getting a knot in my stomach. But I’m not there yet, and I wish he could respect that.
For pronouns…how much patience am I obligated to have? I’ve told him he needs to get his shit together, and he still hasn’t. How much time is too much? A day is probably an unreasonable expectation, but 18 months starts to feel like I’m being too forgiving.
Thanks again for your comment. As I said, I don’t think we see eye-to-eye on a lot, but this did help me get my thoughts in order. (Although perhaps not the way you intended!)
No intentions, Rebecca. My words are offered with no agenda or intention. I gave up playing politics a long, long time ago. So no intention, no agenda. Just a few words that I thought might be helpful.
I don’t know about the pronouns; I don’t often read your blog, so I have no idea how much you’ve written on the subject. I don’t know what the answer is; I suspect there isn’t one. There often isn’t any clear answer when it comes to family.
Good luck.
I’m not speaking for Rebecca, I’m mearly stating my own opinions on the matter. And I’m also being honest, so know this is not angry or defensive.
I don’t think Rebecca is demanding her father take them down and burn them, but for the moment not have them up. And sure this sounds like she isn’t trying to see that her dad is going through a hard time (because if you read some of her other posts you come to see that Rebecca clearly sees and understands her fathers struggle)but it’s just not as simple as saying ‘they are his cherished memories’.
Rebecca is going through a lot, most of us can’t even begin to comprehend what she has to go through. So just like respecting that Rebecca should be referred by female pronouns, pictures of a past she is working to make right, should be put away. She is still healing and working towards becoming free from her prison, she should be able to do it without having to view supposed ‘happy’ times in which she felt trapped inside.
I mean it’s like if you HAD to smile in a picture when you were not happy, and everytime you looked at that picture, you would be reminded of how that smile was not real. It’s painful.
The thing about the photos is that they don’t have to be on display, they can be put in a photoalbum which the father can view at his own discretion. And at the same time I think would allow her father to better be able to move on. The thing I feel her father has to work on is being able to accept Rebecca. To be able to realize that Rebecca changing does not invalidate the memories they made. He needs to understand that he shouldn’t be holding on to ‘his son’. And that’s exactly what he’s doing, he’s not holding on to memories of the past, he’s holding on to Rebecca being his son.
By him not being able to use the correct pronouns, this shows a lot. I think that once he is able to really work on this, he will be able to see those pictures and remember the actual mememories and not the sex of Rebecca. I think that if he is able to do this and Rebecca is able to change and heal in a place that she feels safe, maybe one day those pictures won’t hurt as much. One day they can look at them and say ‘that was a nice day’.
You actually made me realize something important: I don’t know that my dad knows I’m not asking him to take the pictures down and burn them. He may be thinking that this is a ‘forever’ thing, when I”m really hoping it’s a ‘for now ‘thing. I should probably make that more clear to him…
I’m with Em on the pronoun thing. He might well be trying, but he’s not struggling with memory or habit. He’s struggling with acknowledging you as his daughter. That’s why you’re reacting to it. He’s telling you that he does not see you as his daughter. You need to be around people who see you as a woman. The sooner he acknowledges that as the actual problem, the better for both of you.
Would it help, maybe, to point out that other people who have known you for a long time are not having this problem? And to ask him to think about why that might be?
As far as the pictures…I’m with you. Say you had just gotten out of an abusive marriage, one whose horrific true nature had been secret from everyone in your family. Say your dad danced at your wedding and invited your abusive then-husband to family reunions, etc. etc. Say he thought his child was happy and in love, and only recently found out that she was actually completely miserable.
Would he want those pictures on the wall or would they look very different in light of this revelation?
Your realities are not equally important. He saw a happy son who was neither. You see the person you were, the life you and only you experienced firsthand. You were unhappy.
I understand that your transition is difficult for him, but these refusals are all clear indications of his unwillingness to try.
>>>By him not being able to use the correct pronouns, this shows a lot.
It REALLY does. I think “I’m trying” is bullshit, frankly. You know, my 85 year old nanna can’t always remember people’s names, she runs through about three or four before getting my (cis) sister’s right. And since English is her second language, she’s *always* had trouble with pronouns for everyone.
But STILL, even with those issues, she tried hard for months to get mine right – straight away after I told everyone. She’d mess up and you could see, she was furious at herself. And by the end of six months even with her wonky memory she managed it to get it right, as much as she can get anyone’s name and pronouns right.
Long story short: if my nanna can get these things right within six months then ANYONE can if they genuinely want to.
I like “the nanna threshold” as a litmus test
You know it makes sense!
I think the thing is, you yourself know when someone is genuinely trying and when they’re just taking the piss and saying “I’m trying” to cover themselves. The difference becomes obvious soon enough…